In 1996 the band KISS decided to do a full reunion tour with makeup and original band members Ace Frehley and Peter Criss. This was great for fans, but terrible for Bruce Kulick and Eric Singer who were placed in temporary limbo by the band. As the reunion became more successful it became apparent that Bruce and Eric would not be returning to the band.

John Corabi had replaced Vince Neil in MOTLEY CRUE after their controversial break up. The band with Corabi released a self titled album in 1994, but the album was rejected by hard core CRUE fans. Faced with the possibility of another album with Corabi doing poorly the band decided to reunite with Neil in 1996. This left Corabi out in the cold and in a surprisingly similar situation as Kulick.

Corabi and Kulick met through common friends and started talking about working together on a new project. It seemed that they were destined to work together, and their ideas of what type of music to produce was very much the same. They have formed a band called UNION, and along with drummer Brent Fitz and bassist James Hunting, are releasing an album on Mayhem Records on February 24th.

Recently I had the opportunity to talk with Bruce Kulick about his new band and what the future holds for the guitarist. He had a lot to say, and was also very enthusiastic about all of the possibilities associated with the new project.

RAG: How did you come up with the name UNION?

BRUCE: The name came really from all of us working really hard on it for a couple of days and looking at the computer. Brent, our drummer, actually wrote down that word. John and I got excited about it and then the management did. You know, it's a one word thing and it represents us.

RAG: Obviously fans know a lot about you and John, but I was hoping you could talk a little about the other members of the band.

BRUCE: Basically, John and I started it all by getting together and feeling each other out and getting very comfortable with each other very quickly. Brent was a friend of mine in L.A. who I met through a singer I was working with last year, Lenita Erickson. Brent knew her and we even did a couple of little acoustic things here in Los Angeles. In a very casual way I asked him to come over to the studio where we were recording.

RAG: Did you invite him to have him audition?

BRUCE: Well, I set up some drums that Eric Singer actually lent Curt Cuomo. Curt is the guy that is the other co-writer and co-producer on the UNION record. He's the guy who co-wrote songs on CARNIVAL OF SOULS with Paul. So, you know it really wasn't an audition, but when I listened to him play I got excited thinking that he would probably fit with John and I. We threw one of the song riffs at him to see how he would interpret the drums, and sure enough he came up with an exciting beat. That made us feel he would be a good choice.

After that we auditioned some bass players just through word of mouth. We didn't really have an open call or anything like that because I didn't want to do it that way. Brent and I were actually at a birthday party in this big club that had different music in different rooms. One room was a rock room and there he was. I was very impressed with Jamie on bass. Jamie Hunting is his name and he's from California. He has worked with people like David Lee Roth, and I knew him, but I didn't remember him. He was working in a band with a guy who was co-writing with Axl Rose a lot. This guy West Arkeen, but the guy died of an overdose. He was like a bass player without a home. It was good timing and I told him, "Look we are all coming out of something kind of weird right now, but this is going to be a positive thing and we are just going to work hard and get out there." We started getting Brent and Jamie involved in the recording of the demos we had.

At that point we were still shopping our original demo. Sure enough we found this label Mayhem. They got very excited with what they heard and they didn't want to change it. They saw the vision that John and I had for the music, and that we believed in it. They knew if it is done well and with a lot of integrity that the KISS fans would dig it. That would be at least a starting point for us to get out into the marketplace. Being that rock music isn't the big thing in the music biz right now. I still think there are more people who dig it than not, it's just so diversified. Much more than it has ever been. So basically I'm very happy with how the four of us got together. It evolved through the year. The label got involved and just totally believed in it a hundred percent.

RAG: Did you get any kind of backlash when you initially started shopping around your tape to record labels?

BRUCE: Some people didn't want to even hear it because of the KISS and MOTLEY connection. Some were very excited with it and liked it, but also knew that there was no way it would make it past them. In the sense that their higher-ups wouldn't be willing to spend money on it.

RAG: Wouldn't they think though that there would be a large fan base that would be really interested in a project like this?

BRUCE: Yeah there is no doubt that they were all aware that there is a fan base, but major labels in general sign what's the flavor of the month. KISS is not the flavor of the month. Certainly on that tour they were huge. It's not as if the entire catalog has been in the top twenty. What happened was an event that hadn't happened in 17 years got together and played, and did a fine job of it. But what happens when you look at MOTLEY and the current KISS is, you don't see them as current bands.

RAG: You look at them as nostalgia acts basically.

BRUCE: Right, even though the fans know otherwise. Remember the situation is such that the labels are looking for the most current thing, or something like the most current thing. It's hard for them to get it. It's not that the music couldn't sell, and it's not that it isn't good stuff. So that was the problem with major labels and we understood that. Even though we had a couple of fans inside the major labels that really believed in it.

RAG: Did you ever consider shopping it around and not saying this is what it is? Just give it a listen first and be honest?

BRUCE: Yes, I think it's a terrible thing to do though. First of all management didn't want to do that because it would make them look like charlatans. Let the people know who we are. If you don't want to get it, then we don't want you either. I'll respect the fact that you don't want to go that way but I don't want to have to trick you into thinking I'm the right guy for you, or the right band for your label.

RAG: Were Mayhem interested right from the beginning?

BRUCE: Absolutely! Managers got a call as soon as they got the tape that they were very excited about the music, and it didn't take long. What is great about Mayhem is they are an independent label but are also related to Atlantic. If we sell enough copies Atlantic will get involved, in the sense of their promotions team. That's very exciting. Not that Mayhem doesn't have good distribution.

RAG: So Mayhem is a small label, but not a true independent?

BRUCE: Right, they are linked to one of the major labels, and I know Atlantic is well aware of who we are and what we are doing. They just want to see some numbers before they get involved. One thing that has happened in this business, which is unfortunate, is a lot of bean counting. If your on the low end of that count people are afraid to spend money. But you have to spend money to make money. I personally laid out my own money to get started making the demos. Of course I got reimbursed because we got our deal, but I'm a firm believer that you've got to sometimes spend. Now I'm not telling you to mortgage your home on your project, but get out there.

I was totally aware that if no labels got it, the fans would. If I had to sell it myself at the KISS Conventions I would. Of course it didn't come to that, but I wasn't going to get discouraged or look back. I refused to.

RAG: Have the songs changed much from their original demo form?

BRUCE: No we kept the performance and transferred them over to a very expensive 24 track machine and added some things to it. I didn't want to lose those demos, and I didn't want to try to beat the demos. We decided to use them and improve on them in the studio. They were originally done with a lot of care as if they were masters anyway. We didn't lose any of the magic, we just sonically improved on it.

RAG: When you and John initially got together did the managers or record labels pressure you to sound like KISS or MOTLEY CRUE?

BRUCE: I've got to admit that management was very supportive of whatever John and I wanted to do. John and I decided to write music that we would get off on, and I think since we dig it so much the KISS and MOTLEY fans will enjoy it. When we shopped it, some people from the Japanese market heard it and they actually wanted a KISS or MOTLEY sounding record. Their reaction was, we know it's good but we don't know how it would do with the KISS and MOTLEY fans. It got me angry, but I have to understand their point of view. Hey, I didn't design KISS or MOTLEY, even though I love both of those bands. Just to say your album is going to have all of those signature riffs of those bands is weird. I don't know who will release it in Japan, but it will have a bonus track. The Japanese market always requests that.

RAG: Do you already have a song picked out?

BRUCE: Right now it's probably going to be song that I sang. It's called FOR YOU, and it's very different than I WALK ALONE from CARNIVAL OF SOULS.

RAG: Is all of the material on the album brand new, or is there something left over from your time in KISS?

BRUCE: Actually there are a couple of ideas that Gene Simmons and Bob Ezrin heard that didn't get developed. They were just riffs, but a riff can become a great song. There were a couple that John presented me with from his sitting around period with MOTLEY. Where he didn't know if he was coming or going. That turned into a couple of the songs on the record. Why not take off of things that already exist?

RAG: Is that mainly how you write? You start with a guitar riff in your head and then it goes from there?

BRUCE: Yes, exactly! Sometimes John will have a title concept, but in general those concepts fit a riff or a style of the song. There are no rules to it. Just for me being a guitarist it's easier to start with a guitar riff.

RAG: Did John write most of the lyrics on the record?

BRUCE: Well, remember I mentioned Curt Cuomo? Curt was very much involved. Most of these songs are split three ways. We all contributed each way, and I would have to say to be honest to the others, that my contributions were more on the music end than the lyric end. We were all each others critics.

RAG: Is it kind of scary being on your own again after ten years, or do you feel kind of set free from the whole KISS thing?

BRUCE: It was weird. I obviously feel a lot of strength in the fact that I'm involved with some very talented people. I'm with a label and I feel like I have a home now. I was of course frightened initially. Now I've got to get out and make some money, you know? I'm very pleased with where this UNION band is at, and I feel very comfortable now.

RAG: How soon after the albums release do you think you will start touring?

BRUCE: I think it will be within a month from then and obviously we have hopes of getting some type of arena tour with a big band. If not, just obviously hitting the cities where we know there are rock crowds, and doing a club tour. We will start wherever we have to.

RAG: Do you plan on playing any KISS or MOTLEY songs when you tour?

BRUCE: Yes, I mean think about it. The set list could be open to a lot of really cool stuff. I want to play stuff from the MOTLEY record that MOTLEY won't do. KISS doesn't want to do anything that is 1980 and on, so that leaves us open to stuff. Obviously REVENGE or CARNIVAL OF SOULS stuff can be done. We can also do stuff from John's previous band THE SCREAM. We know we are covered with material. Between the eleven on the album and these others we have plenty of material.

RAG: I was hoping to talk a little about CARNIVAL OF SOULS. Were you nervous about the fans reaction to your singing debut.

BRUCE: No, I was anxious for them to hear it. It wasn't on a lot of the bootleg copies, but then again not all of the bootlegs had all eleven songs.

RAG: I always thought the fact that the album was so heavily bootlegged proved that there was still a lot of interest in your lineup of KISS. Does it bother you that KISS seems to be dismissing the 80's and all the music that came out? I mean you guys put out some great songs, and the tours were fun.

BRUCE: Look, I have a few different opinions but certainly the makeup era, press wise and maybe numbers wise, will always be a bigger thing. I understand that, but I'm proud of everything we have done. I'm not sure they need to totally turn their backs on it, or not include any of it, but maybe it works best when kept separate. The makeup version and the non-makeup version.

RAG: It was hard for fans to hear Gene saying that the 80's were horrible and that his head wasn't totally into the music.

BRUCE: He said that even before they put the makeup back on. In some ways Paul's metal pop stuff that we were doing in the 80's was more popular than what Gene was coming up with. I think that's kind of why he said it. I think on REVENGE Gene came back in a very strong form as you can tell with UNHOLY. Sometimes Gene says things and doesn't mean he's putting down the band, but yeah it pissed off Paul and the rest of the band.

RAG: I understand you played most of the guitars on the record.

BRUCE: I played a little more than on REVENGE, but not all of them. Paul certainly played guitar on a lot of the tracks. I only played bass on a couple of things. I am playing bass on THE JUNGLE. I played on the demo, and this has happened before. Even during HOT IN THE SHADE. We all beat each other up to make a great record and worked very hard and everybody was always there. I stand by CARNIVAL OF SOULS. It was a band record.

RAG: What happened to Bob Ezrin? I originally heard that he was producing the record.

BRUCE: Bob was involved in the beginning to try and help out. He helped us form the darker direction. He saw the material we were bringing in, and he wound up picking a lot of the same songs that we wound up using for the record. Then he was very busy with other commitments. He has this company that produces CD roms.

RAG: You said Ezrin liked the darker direction, but did the record company give you guys a hard time about going in that direction?

BRUCE: No, they never get involved in that. They let a band like KISS do what it wants to do.

RAG: Obviously your time in KISS came to an end after the reunion on MTV UNPLUGGED. At what point during that whole process did you realize that this thing with Ace and Peter might become permanent?

BRUCE: I always knew that it could happen any time. That they could get along and work out their differences. They never promised that they would never go back in the makeup or anything like that. I think it just kind of pushed the timing of it. That they would all be able to get together and work together and make it happen. I was always aware of that, but did that make me feel like it was more likely? Yes, and no. I didn't like to think about that anyway, because I want to concentrate on doing my music, and being valuable in KISS. I didn't want to go there, you know?

RAG: Did Paul and Gene make it seem like it was going to be a short time thing, and then you would return with the band?

BRUCE: I don't think they realized how successful it might be. It was safer to say, "Look, we're putting the makeup on and Eric and Bruce are cool with everything." Which we were! Obviously the success of it just pushed the issue.

RAG: A lot of fans think you are the best KISS guitarist, but do you think Ace Frehley has a legend that is impossible for anyone to compete with?

BRUCE: Thank you. I do feel like there is a shadow there. First of all Ace did a great job with the band, and he played a lot of memorable lyrical solos. He was a very strong character in the makeup, which was very special of course. It's not a fair comparison, the band with makeup, and the band without makeup. They are two different bands. I was always aware of that, and I never tried to mist the illusion of that.

RAG: Is there anything you want to say to your fans to sum up this interview?

BRUCE: Yeah, I just want to let anyone who is reading this know that they can contact Mayhem if they want to help, there is the UNION WORKFORCE as we are calling it. We want people to spread the word. I really appreciate the support from the fans. They have been great.

I want to thank Bruce Kulick for taking time out to do this interview. He was truly a classy guy. Bruce wanted to make sure that fans were aware of how to contact him and the band UNION. Bruce has his own email and web-site:

brucekool@aol.com and http://www.nextlevel.com/brucekulick/